Story

Debian to vote on init system... again

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Supporting projects needed (Score: 1)

by evilviper@pipedot.org on 2014-10-18 00:46 (#2TEW)

It isn't just software depending on systemd, it's also projects that have been encompassed by it. Services few people even think about, like udev, dbus, and others, are being swallowed by systemd, and no longer developed as a result. A vote won't change reality, somebody is going to have to put in the time and money to pick up development of those and similar inglorious "glue" projects, to keep SystemV init working.

I could do without another systemd shouting-match...

Re: Supporting projects needed (Score: 2)

by nadaou@pipedot.org on 2014-10-18 07:58 (#2TEY)

To be honest I really wouldn't be sad if d-bus went away. It suffers many of the same design and philosophy clash problems that systemd does and more often than not is a major pain in the neck for sysadmins of serious workstations and servers. Creating files in /home which even root can't access? Are they nuts? I can actually put a number on the lost productivity-hours these Pottering creations have caused us and we're not an especially large outfit. NetworkManager, d-bus, systemd may be a fine solution for a personal laptop install of Fedora or Ubuntu, but that's about as far as it goes. And that's not Debian's target audience.
I could do without another systemd shouting-match...
Much better that we have our shouting matches now than the Debian project self-destructs later.

Re: Supporting projects needed (Score: 1)

by nadaou@pipedot.org on 2014-10-18 08:21 (#2TEZ)

Oh and story submitters, lets keep the trolling and editorializing to a minimum, eh?

Re: Supporting projects needed (Score: 1)

by skarjak@pipedot.org on 2014-10-18 13:29 (#2TF0)

Editorializing maybe, but there's zero trolling in there. I figured if my editiorializing wasn't accepted, the editor would just remove it.

Re: Supporting projects needed (Score: 1, Insightful)

by nadaou@pipedot.org on 2014-10-19 05:39 (#2TFA)

> but there's zero trolling in there.

specificially, I found this way over the top,
Is this vote an attempt to delay the inevitable?
and this
as second-class citizen, with many developpers choosing not to bother supporting anything that's not systemd?
the first is begging the question and a sophomoric rhetorical clichi©, the second continues the fait accompli with rampant speculation and overall comes across as mainly designed to provoke a reactionary response by pressing people's buttons (thus the trolling).

I welcome the discussion and it's healthy to have it, but let's maintain some respectful decorum. Especially here, as one of the biggest complaints about Pottering is that he continually steers these discussions away from the technical and towards the emotional using (pretty lame) manipulative rhetorical tricks.

--
http://www.xenu.net/archive/baloney_detection.html

Re: Supporting projects needed (Score: 4, Insightful)

by zafiro17@pipedot.org on 2014-10-19 13:56 (#2TFD)

Your non-rhetorical, expertly developed, speculation-free articles are welcome. Submit button is at the top right of your screen. You know what to do.

Moderation

Time Reason Points Voter
2014-10-19 13:58 Insightful +1 evilviper@pipedot.org
2014-10-19 14:42 Insightful +1 skarjak@pipedot.org
2014-10-19 20:19 Insightful +1 beldin@pipedot.org

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